None have dared pee in the direction of Podshow until now. I had heard all of this Podshow contract information over the past 4 months from a variety of sources, and that had inspired many of my cautionary comments in the Podcheck Review. Now, thanks to some outspoken podcasters, you can now hear the entire Podshow contract.. [Updated 3/20/06 8:15am for spelling, etc.]
Listen in horror and disbelief as Keith and the Girl essentially read the Podshow contract in their podcast. I listened to a few minutes of the show, and then kept listening, and kept listening…
http://shitecom.libsyn.com/index.php?post_id=73950
The moral of the story: Remember - ALWAYS read your contracts carefully, and assume that the other guy is trying to screw you. It doesn’t matter if it’s Podshow, Libsyn/Kiptronic, Podtrac, CitiBank, your employer, or whomever - no one is more interested in your success than you. Protect your passion, and understand your long-term commitments.
Here are some interesting interpretations of elements in the Podshow contract as read by KATG:
Details after the jump…
First Year Monthly download bonuses
- 0 - 5,000 downloads = $0 bonus for the month
- 5,000 - 10,000 = $40 for the month
- 10K - 25K = $100
- 25K - 50K = $200
- 50K - 75K = $300
- 75K - 100K = $400
- Second Year Bonus - add 25% to the first year scale
Third Year Bonus - add 25% to the previous year
Payments and Fees:
- Producers may receive bonuses for driving people to registrations as part of network promotions.
- Producers may have an opportunity to participate in ad campaigns, and may receive revenue from ad campaigns. The contract as read by KATG was non-specific regarding percentages.
- Monthly payments from Podshow, with a payment threshold of $40.
- Producers have creative control, beyond changing the “direction” of the show.
- Podshow accepts no responsibility for the shows’ content. Podshow maintains complete control over distribution of the show.
- The contract term is 1-year, with Podshow reserving the right to add up to another two years.
- Podshow reserves the right to cancel the contract via e-mail at any time after the first year. If Podshow cancels the contract “for any cause” as determined by Podshow, Podshow owes you no more money. Podshow may also cease distributing any of your episodes for any reason as determined by Podshow.
Other notes:
- Podshow owns all past and future shows/content and all logos/mascots/whatever associated with the show forever. [In my opinion, it is unlikely that you would ever]
You will neverget the rights to those shows back from them [without some form of payment]. - Podshow has the right to do with your shows whatever they want - CDs, satellite, radio, TV, DVD, yada-yada. There were no contractual specifics regarding fees/payments/royalties/syndication… no specifics other than “Podshow owns your stuff.” Ouch.
- The contract does not make you an employee of Podshow. You remain an “independent contractor.”
- Any contracts/agreement for ad revenue in which you are currently engaged will transfer to Podshow if the existing agreement extends beyond three months into your contract with Podshow.
Well. That’s that. Not the worst contract I’ve ever heard. In retrospect, that contract I signed when the devil gave me my voice was a bad contract. Live and learn!
March 30th, 2006 at 3:01 am
BIIIIG kudos for noting the details here. Thanks for the summary!! And, of course, for throwing in one of those Scott Fletcher-isms there at the end.
March 30th, 2006 at 9:42 am
Scott,
Interesting post, although I have not heard the Keith and the Girl show its kind of fun knowing the controversy is spicing up the community. The cool thing about podcasting is anyone can do it, the bad thing about podcasting is anyone can do it. I like your advice, “protect your passion” for others I suggest, find your love and stick with it.
Ron and Adam are very smart business men who I believe have done good things, the point is no one is evil here except for talented people who choose not do anything, if Podshow can help you get noticed more power to you.
For me I will keep listening and appreciating everything from your show, Podcast411 (must listen for everyone), Gillmor Gang,
Accident Hash, Skepticality, Catholic Insider, IT Conversations, Diggnation, TWIT, Podcast Brothers, and speaking of Brothers, of course DSC that is where I first heard of Brother Love.
Great things going on in Podcast Land. Sure beats BS Radio and TV. Except sports of course, its almost Baseball Season.
March 30th, 2006 at 3:16 pm
I listened to that podcast and I didn’t hear about how much Podshow was paying as regular pay. Did I miss it? I thought I remembered Keith say that he was going to mention it in the cast. So I guess the question remains… Is the regular pay good enough for everyone that signed contracts to just say “Who cares?”
I mean, a lot of people will do anything for money including selling of souls (J/K Scott). Really, does anyone know how much was the salary for each individual show? I remember how freaked out Dawn and Drew were when Drew quit his job to do this full time. I guess if it is good enough money for the podcasters that signed, that they are smart enough to save some back in case Podshow doesn’t renew later on.
March 30th, 2006 at 4:40 pm
Michael Goehegan’s blog (www.mwgblog.com) hints that Dawn and Drew may have a very different situation, including a “salary” as Tony mentions.
My read (listen?) of the contract is that there is no salary, just download bonus and advertising revenue opportunties. Given that Adam Curry did not refute a single details we must assume this contact is quite accurate, though I assume Podshow is willing to negotiate on certain points (ownership of shows, for example).
On a certain level this contact is incredibly vague, though I assume that podcasters have discussions with Podshow about ad revenue expectations before either party signs the contact.
March 30th, 2006 at 5:42 pm
Regarding salaries, there is a difference between the unwashed masses in the Podshow Podcast Delivery Network (PDN) and the elite “Pod Squad” that is hand-picked based on popularity, quality, and target demographics. It is my understanding that the flagship shows in the Pod Squad are either employed by, or are gauranteed predictable revenue from, Podshow. The Pod Squad shows seem to have the clout to negotiate individual agreements with PodShow.
Just another quick commentary from me regarding the “standard” PDN contract: The language in the contract, and the overall mission of the contract, seems to be designed to protect Podshow. That fact does not indict the contract as being “bad.”
It does give me pause, however, considering the plight of an up-and-coming show’s inability to renegotiate the contract for a period of three years and the inability to retain any of the intellectual property generated during the course of the agreement.
These “problems of success” are issues that very few podcasters will ever have to deal with. However, I pity the producers that do actually hit it big while under the contractual obligations set forth by the PDN contract that KATG read aloud on their show.
Who is responsible for the success of a show? Is it the talent that created the show, or is it the promotional machine that might be responsible for driving listeners to the show? The answers to these questions should be the subject of renegotiation based on the performance of both parties. As I understand it, the PDN contract prevents the show’s producers from engaging in a renegotiation with Podshow for a period of three years, after which PodShow would own the “media property” and place the content producer in a weak bargaining position. That would be an unfortunate feature of the contract (for the content producer).
Whatever your choice, my only hope is that your choice of ad/podcast networks brings value to you and your audience, and also brings you more enjoyment from your passionate pursuit of that which you love. Fight the good fight.
–Scott
April 1st, 2006 at 2:42 pm
[…] Podcheck Review has some of the details, but not the actual contract. […]
April 2nd, 2006 at 11:27 am
I think what most people are missing in all of this is that of all the premium Pod Squad content, almost none of it can generate revenue on its own. Vertical, niche shows. Unproven advertising medium.
Yeast Radio. Dawn and Drew. These shows need PodShow. Gillmor Gang could do it on its own, but its content would always have a niche audience.
Keith and the Girl doesn’t need PodShow. They have professed their inability to market themselves and are fortunate to have many people coming to help them. It makes perfect sense for Dawn and Drew to go with PodShow. Their appeal will always be limited, so they benefit from PodShow’s ability to bring in advertisers that get a group buy.
Keith and the Girl could easily bring in their own substantial revenue, which could eventually bring them to traditional radio (or their own contract with satellite radio), where they’d make a whole lot more.
PodShow’s contract is what you’d expect from a media company, although the pay is substantially less. And I’m sure Dawn and Drew did not get that contact, except for the ownership pieces. However, given that they still beg their listeners for donations, it’s probably not much.
April 2nd, 2006 at 11:48 am
Les contrats de PodshowPodshow est une soci鴩 am鲩caine fond饠par Adam Curry, un des inventeurs du podcasting (mꭥ s’il aimerait faire croire qu’il en est le seul). Podshow est sp飩alis頤ans le d鶥loppement, le management et la promotion de programmes…
April 2nd, 2006 at 12:28 pm
I thought the discussion of the Podshow contract was interesting and enjoyed the “Podshow Players” on the Daily Source Code giving their reaction to the reading. Thanks for giving us the heads-up on this.
I’ve seen my share of contracts in my past consulting business and I have yet to find any contract I would sign without a modification here and there. All contracts are drafted to give the major rights to the one owning the contract. You must read and understand everything before signing on the bottom line. Better yet, have it reviewed by a lawyer.
One case in point is the agreement on Podzinger.com. I thought it would be cool to submit my podcast to have it “audio indexed” until I read the agreement. It basically says I give Podzinger “perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, royalty-free, transferable, right and license” for use in their service. That may be fine for now but what if their service changes and they want to do ad insertions? I would not be able to cancel or stop my feed from being used in that way with the current agreement.
I think a lot of people will sign contracts because they don’t read and understand what’s written or they are so excited about what they getting (i.e., the chance to be a part of Podshow) and they don’t think ahead as to the limitations they may face in the future.
Anyway, keep up the good work Scott. I enjoyed hearing your interview on the David Lawrence last week.
-Tom
The Fogview Podcast
www.fogview.com
April 2nd, 2006 at 10:03 pm
I have seen the contract and read the whole thing. There is no pay per show. The only guarantee of money is the $400 per month for 100,000 or more downloads. The contract does not stipulate how the term “download” is defined. There is no guarantee for any money past 100,000 downloads.
Anyone quitting their day job for $400 per month?
April 4th, 2006 at 2:36 am
The 40 for 5000 downloads isn’t that good! I get $20 bucks for 1000 ads played via Fruitcast and I still own my podcast.
JMTC
Molly
PS. Plus I don’t have to play Podsafe music from there network!
April 7th, 2006 at 7:54 pm
Just a update about a comment I left about Podzinger.com and the issue I had with the language in the “agreement.” Podzinger responded to my email and concerns and they changed the wording in their agreement. I was happy with their response the changes they made and I plan to give their service a test. It’s nice to find a company that listens to issues raised about their products or services.
-Tom
The Fogview Podcast
www.fogview.com
April 11th, 2006 at 8:07 pm
Don’t worry Dave, if Scott wants a copy I can send him one.
He’s on point so far.
June 11th, 2006 at 12:36 pm
Podshow Moving into the UK
Adam Curry’s Podshow Network is officially moving into the UK. Podshow has been operating in the US for a while now, and enjoying some decent popularity and a little bit of scandal. (For the record, there’s nothing scandalous about Podshow’s…
April 23rd, 2008 at 9:25 pm
[…] and the Girl were shopping around for an ad network, they got their hands on a copy of a PodShow talent contract and read it on air. The company which purports to give their producers the ability to quit their day job was revealed […]
April 23rd, 2008 at 10:59 pm
[…] and the Girl were shopping around for an ad network, they got their hands on a copy of a PodShow talent contract and read it on air. The company which purports to give their producers the ability to quit their day job was revealed […]
April 25th, 2008 at 3:57 am
[…] heeft genoemd, maar ook bekend staat als een bekende WikiPedia moderator, en bekend staat om de wurgcontracten de boodschap ook begrepen. Zijn Podshow.com is inmiddels overleden. Podshow.com linkt inmiddels […]
April 28th, 2008 at 1:05 am
[…] was one of the worst things to happen to podcasting as a new medium. Divisive, ego-driven, contractually dodgy and hyped to the gills, it has been clear for some time that their style of doing things wasn’t […]